Beyond self - sufficiency

[eco4560]

“Self is not the sufficiency level. Somehow the neighbourhood community tribal grouping is where food supply is resilient.” He goes on to say that we need to stop thinking of ‘my’ everything, but instead ‘my food supply is our food supply.’

From out on the Home Page today.

[Grahame]

Exactly

[Grahame]

Also, I suspect there is gross misunderstanding out there (particularly in the rich west) of the term sufficiency.

[purplepear]

enough needs to be enough

[gardenlen]

g'day eco',

can't expect much out of a divided secular australia, other countries not quiet as bad but bad enough for the rot of "united we stand - divided we fall" to hold sway, very obvious also now we are back in rural, too many in the divided culture society who do not have the rule of thumb "live and let live". it's more what's right for me bucko' definitely is not right for the other.

len

[eco4560]

It's a sad world we live in isn't it Len? Here I am sitting on 'my' bit of land with 'my' garden and 'my' food. Tom my PDC teacher is on his bit of land doing the same thing. And both of us moan about not having enough hours in the day to be able to look after our places and how we should live in a community that grows together. Somehow we need to get past the western concept of 'what is mine is mine' and find ways to share.

[gardenlen]

honestly eco',

it is truly a sad world, the simple things that may have been useful are now complicated with ego and money, called killing the goose that may have laid the golden egg.

yes and there you are and your friend being individuals, and here i am about to start building gardens again and planting food and some habitat trees as well as chook house, with poor health, can only work when there is no sun or heat from it, and n o chance this side of hades of any help, there are lots like us.

in this instance we are far apart, but with those yuppy types who have no sense of live and let live, there is no chance of any change, those who worship other things won't appreciate this but we need a better ethic to work toward unity as an australian community, like islam they have a common belief, and the Buddhists etc.,. etc.,. they display the same or similar written ethics, we have our roots why take on someone elses.

where we live now we drive past yard after yard min' size 1.25 acres up to 6 acres probably more, large areas of lawns and ornamental trees, no signs up offering excess anything not a vege' garden in site, for the main. ok those like the teacher go to work 9-5 means 8.3-5.30. lots of effort gone into creating lawn and gardens.

so due to the sun factor my hours very much reduced, the hour or 2 before sun up my best time. got a friend with unkempt gardens he has health issues so like me will barely grow enough food for his own use.

yes secular; divided; individual.

my darling wife will be my backstop.

take care

len

[adiantum]

I've lived in intentional community of one sort or another for most of my adult life. When it works it really works, and a large number of conundrums around sustainability solve themselves at a throw simply because of the opportunities presented by collective action and ownership. But when it goes south, watch out. Two communities blew up in my face! I've also lived in the Third World ( Bangladesh, with travels into India and Nepal) and saw there village and extended family "communities" that seemed to work. It takes a strong will and idealism to choose against mainstream values and live like that...but that same strong will and idealism makes living together with other strong-willed, idealistic people next to impossible much of the time!
My conclusion is that people will make living together work when they have to, and that over generations develop a set of people skills that make it possible and (at least much of the time) enjoyable. Western societies like America and Australia have simple gotten hooked on options, freedom, mobility, and affluence, and that necessary skill set has been lost...or perhaps more or less deliberately discouraged in the name of profit. Many of us have overinflated egos, practice the ethics of individualism, uniqueness, whatever. Bangladeshis, for instance, have a word for "me" and "mine" in the language but you hardly ever hear it. People use (and think) in terms of "we" and "our". After meeting a partner and trying to live in community, what I called "community living skills" she called "licking ass"....and we didn't last much longer in that community!!
Consider the development of the nuclear family as such. It's mostly been after WW2. Before then, even in the "West", extended families were the norm. Grandparents, siblings, distant cousins, whoever in larger groupings than the classic mom and dad and 2 kids. Now think of all of the economic activity going on in these families that has since been shifted into the money economy, beginning with childcare and eldercare and going on to all the other functions of a household or homestead economy...food production and preservation, cottage industries, infrastructure maintenance, etc....and all of these are by and large outsourced into the mainstream cash economy and every adult is expected to participate in this economy in a specialized job. How many modern people don't even cook? I suspect this whole process has been engineered to some extent...

[eco4560]

Nice to hear the voice of experience. Any tips on how to tell in advance which communities are the ones programmed to self destruct and which ones will thrive?

[Pakanohida]

enough needs to be enough

I agree, but as an American, I realize that I have had this insane life, and somethings are hard to let go of. IE transitioning to living simply as Grahame eludes to. I guess admitting that is the 1st step to addressing the problems.