The answer is technology

[grease]

Did anyone catch 4 Corners tonite? We are apparently to be saved by technology. The best bit is it will be economical, the bad bit is it will take time, the unknown part is where it will come from. I'm relieved because I don't have to commit so much effort to leaving a small footprint on this earth. :D Did anyone watch this program :shock:

[markg]

Yeah, I thought it was good - Jonathan Holmes does a good job.

Regarding climate change, I think we're screwed. I see solutions having to come from a top-down approach i.e. govts implementing carbon taxes, as the problem is too big for individuals to make any difference. Whereas something like peak oil I think can be approached by bottom up solutions - individuals & communities largely bypassing govt indifference. There is so much self-interest in politics & business, I honestly think it will be too late for a lot of people by the time the powers that be are forced to do something. But it'll be the people in developing countries that get affected first & who cares about them eh :?

Anyway it was interesting to get the overall picture of what is happening here & see some of the players. Howard will not be looked upon kindly by future generations.

[Jez]

Thanks for mentioning it Grease - I'll have to try and catch the repeat on Wednesday night.

One of the biggest problems associated with reducing emissions and air pollution in general is the phenomenon of 'global dimming'...the earth is actually cooler than it would be if there wasn't such a thick layer of particles in the atmosphere. This layer lessens the amount of solar radiation which reaches the surface - and temperatures as a consequence.

So radically cutting emissions would quite probably cause a directly proportionate warming anyway...not to mention the fact that it's been proven that this 'dimming' phenomenon has also lessened evaporation rates as the dimming has increased...perhaps the most important factor for a relatively arid continent like Australia.

Bit of a case of damned if you do and damned if you don't...that's the most worrying factor IMO.

[frosty]

But it'll be the people in developing countries that get affected first & who cares about them eh :?



ironically so far its not !


Published on Thursday, August 17, 2006 by Agence France Presse
US Suffers World's First Climate Change Exodus: Study
by Jitendra Joshi

The first mass exodus of people fleeing the disastrous effects of climate change is not happening in low-lying Pacific islands but in the world's richest country, a US study said.

"The first massive movement of climate refugees has been that of people away from the Gulf Coast of the United States," said the Earth Policy Institute, which has warned for years that climate change demands action now.

Institute president Lester Brown said that about a quarter of a million people who fled the devastating impact of Hurricane Katrina a year ago must now be classed as "refugees".

"Interestingly, the country to suffer the most damage from a hurricane is also primarily responsible for global warming," he said.

The United States is the world's largest consumer of energy, but has refused to sign up to the Kyoto pact aimed at reducing emissions of gases that scientists say are to blame for heating up the Earth.

Many environmentalists had expected the first big population shift to come somewhere like the Tuamotu islands in French Polynesia, the world's largest chain of atolls which rise barely metres (feet) from the Pacific.

Rising sea levels are part of the problem afflicting low-lying places but, experts argue, so are tropical storms that are mounting in ferocity because of warmer ocean temperatures.

Brown said many thousands of people who evacuated last year as Katrina slammed into New Orleans and other populated areas on the Mississippi and Louisiana coasts had no intention of returning.

"We estimate that at least 250,000 of them have established homes elsewhere and will not return," he said.

"They no longer want to face the personal trauma and financial risks associated with rising seas and more destructive storms. These evacuees are now climate refugees."

Many businesses have also deserted the coastal towns left ravaged by Katrina as insurance and other costs soar, the study said.

"As rising seas and more powerful hurricanes translate into higher insurance costs in these coastal communities, people are retreating inland," Brown said.

"And just as companies migrate to regions with lower wages, they also migrate to regions with lower insurance costs."

The study also warned: "The experience with more destructive storms in recent years is only the beginning."

The institute said that since 1970, the Earth's average temperature has risen by one degree Fahrenheit, but by 2100 it could rise by up to 10 degrees Fahrenheit (six degrees Celsius).

Rising temperatures could melt glaciers and polar ice caps, raising sea levels and displacing coastal residents worldwide.

"The flow of climate refugees to date numbers in the thousands, but if we do not quickly reduce CO2 (carbon dioxide) emissions, it could one day number in the millions," Brown said.

The institute's study classed "climate refugees" as part of a larger group of people who have been forced from their homes by man-made environmental change such as overgrazing.

"Overgrazing destroys the vegetation which leads then to local sandstorms ... we are looking at growing flows of environmental refugees in Africa, for example in Nigeria, Senegal, Mauritania or Kenya," Brown told reporters.

Millions of people in northern and western China have abandoned their villages as the land turns semi-arid because of overgrazing, the study said.

China is also the second biggest greenhouse-gas polluter after the United States thanks to the voracious rise in coal, gas and oil consumption to power its economic growth.

The booming port city of Shanghai could be at risk of flooding from more ferocious typhoons linked to global warming as it is only a metre (three feet) above sea level, Brown said.

Copyright © 2006 Agence France Presse

###

[Jez]

That's largely due to the fact they can afford to move elsewhere I think Frosty - often with government help admittedly.

I've read a lot of articles in past months and years about people in poorer countries living in coastal areas which are being literally eaten away by rising sea levels...but they can't afford to move and get no govenment assistance...hence no 'mass exodus'...many probably would relocate if they could.

[frosty]

true jez

but at least if the US is effected the people they may start to think about reducing their energy use :evil: wheras we know they wont if only "furriners" are suffering

frosty

[grease]

The reality is though that the rich people (monetarily wise) in this world can cope (for now). Even if the good old U.S of A does experience some difficulty in the weather it doesn't help the poor until it is politically expedient.

[grease]

And if technology does come to our aid then we will have to pay for it in this democratic, capatilistic world that we are living in. :shock:

[Jez]

true jez

but at least if the US is effected the people they may start to think about reducing their energy use :evil: wheras we know they wont if only "furriners" are suffering

frosty

We can only hope eh Frosty? :)

[frosty]

The reality is though that the rich people (monetarily wise) in this world can cope (for now). Even if the good old U.S of A does experience some difficulty in the weather it doesn't help the poor until it is politically expedient.

that may have bee true with New Orleans but it will be very different if a major hurricane hits Miami :evil: that will effect the rich in their McMansions on all those canals

and I have to admit I think it couldnt happen to a more deserving group :oops: :evil:

I rather enjoyed the irony a while back when the alligators they displaced to build their monstrocity lined canals were coming back and eating the humans who displaced them

on Sunball list a hole ago a guy from florida was wanting enough suncubes to power his Mcmansion and needed a min of 36 ( or arround that ) kw/h a day !!! and claimed he and cut down to that ......... among his "needs" was to run the aircon all day when out to keep his dogs comfortable :evil: :evil:

yes I know my preducdices are showing but I hate greedy capitalist pricks who think they have right to plunder the worlds resources because they have the money :evil: its not restricted to yanks but it does seem to apply to a disproportionate amount of them

frosty